Finally back from working for Godless Dad, I’ve buried myself in theist nonsense again and this post was a fucking gem. 3 Things to say to an atheist is not so much a list of things to say to an atheist, as it is a list of things to say to illustrate your complete lack of understanding of not just atheists… but the whole goddamned world, no holy.
It starts off by asking what atheists do with their guilt, which is fair. It’s a totally fair question and I thought for a moment we’d be having a decent discussion here, today until I read this bit:
The atheist might say that they don’t believe in God but the Bible says that they actually suppress this knowledge. Paul writes in Romans 1:18 that “the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.” The Greek word for suppress is “katechō” which means “to hold back, to detain” or “to restrain” so it is an intentional act of suppressing what they know to be true but what does the atheist do with his or her guilt? Good question.
Is it just me, or did Pastor Jack just ask what we do with our guilt… about denying God? Because Bible says? Jack-in-the-pew is suggesting this as a line of conversation to direct at an atheist, while using a book no atheist believes is true as part of his argument.
Jack, honey, that’s like asking a 6 week old golden retriever what he does with his pension money. He doesn’t have any, kinda like how atheists don’t have guilt over denying god. We don’t believe in him. The only reason you would feel guilt about denying god, is if somewhere deep inside of you, you actually did believe. You can’t honestly be arrogant enough to suggest you know better than I do what I do and do not believe… can you?
His next question is a pretty common one, “Where did the Universe come from?”. My short answer is, we don’t know.
I read about an astrophysicist who said that anywhere from 10 to 15 billion years ago the universe exploded into being but if it didn’t exist before the explosion, then what was it that exploded?
No, you’re confusing the term “big bang” with an explosion. The Big Bang is just the name given to the event and does not accurately describe what may or may not have happened during the event. The Big Bang explanation comes from the very observable fact that the universe is expanding. The expansion, which is again, observed phenomena and undeniable, is of space itself and everything in it. Everything is moving away from everything else at an equal rate. If you reverse that, everything becomes closer at an equal rate, including the space around us. Which means, reverse it and go back far enough in time, and the universe would have been mighty small. The Big Bang theory is about the expansion of the Universe – which has been observed – not an explosion.
Can something that does not exist begin to exist and if it didn’t exist at one time and then did, how can that be so? If would have had to exist prior to exploding into being, right?
We don’t know whether or not something that does not exist can begin to exist. Asking how, when we don’t even know one way or the other if it’s possible, is as useless as a wedding band on Tiger Woods’ finger. The problem here, is that you want an answer despite the fact that we don’t actually have one… yet.
Wanna know what else we didn’t have answers for, for a long time?
How the sun rose and set each day.
How to communicate instantly with someone across the globe.
How to prevent the spread of disease.
How to send wireless signals across continents.
How to propel seafaring vessels with power other than humans or the wind.
Whether or not the earth was flat.
What stars are.
Where the rain came from.
I could go on and on – knowing where our Universe came from is just another in a long line of questions that we are working to answer through observation, technology and the scientific method. Eventually, we will have the answer to this question if humankind manages to keep this planet livable long enough.
You: We haven’t an answer, so it must be god.
Me: We haven’t an answer… yet.
His third, and final question is,
Can you prove there is no God?
This question always makes me gag.
Come on, Jack attack. Do you even know any atheists? Most atheists are agnostic atheists and don’t claim that they know there is no god. An atheist is someone who does not believe in god because there’s no goddamned (no holy) evidence for him. We will live our lives as though there is no god, unless or until evidence for one is presented. Now, before you jump onto your apologetics gatling and start rapid-firing your “evidence” for god at me, you have to learn what actual evidence is. What you have, are arguments for god. It’s not the same thing. If you have, in fact, found irrefutable evidence that is falsifiable and demonstrable to anyone and everyone, well, then you need to collect both your Nobel Prize and a million bucks from the Randi Foundation.
Here are some examples of arguments for god that many mistake as evidence:
The Bible – unless you can prove that the Bible is true with more evidence outside of the Bible itself, the Bible is not evidence for anything but the existence of a book of tales written many moons ago.
Personal experience – as personal experience is not demonstrable, and often not repeatable, and usually all other explanations have not been eliminated by qualified scientists, it cannot count as evidence.
The complexity of the universe – the complexity of the universe is evidence that the universe is complex. You have to prove that god is the explanation for complexity through observable, demonstrable evidence.
There are many more arguments for god that don’t count as evidence and as it stands there is no evidence for a god. This is something all believers admit because they admit they have faith. There is no requirement for faith in something for which there is evidence. You don’t have faith cars are real. You know they are. You don’t have faith the sun will burn you with enough exposure. You know it will. If you say you have faith in God, you’re admitting that you know there is no evidence for him, but you believe anyway.
If there is no God, then is it fair that Hitler and Stalin have no justice served for all their crimes against humanity?
While I disagree that Hitler experienced no suffering for what he did, it hardly matters. Somewhere along the line, you’ve clung to the idea that life and death must be fair. I learned when I was 5, maybe even younger, that life is not fair. I would assume, if there is an afterlife, that it’s not really all that fair either. I mean, all of my Catholic relatives who love me, will be sitting up in a sparkling Heaven, knowing that their heathen kin is burning in the pits of Hell. How then, would Heaven be blissful for them? Would me burning in Hell not be a punishment for me as well as those who love me who might have gone to Heaven?
This is fair to you? Nah, an afterlife wouldn’t be fair. Life is not fair. Deal with it.
No one was ever argued into heaven. Pray for them, try to reason with them but leave their conversion up to God
Agreed. Leave it up to God. See how far that gets you. On the 25th, it’ll be 38 straight years I’ve been an atheist. I have not known one singular day of belief. Lazy fella, that God of yours.